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"Forbidding to Abstain from Eating Meat" :) Hold onto your hats!!

Recently in talking with a friend, he pointed something out to me in the scriptures that I had never noticed before.  Maybe I'm the only one who hasn't noticed it before, but I doubt it.  :)   My mis-reading of this scripture seems pretty universal.  So sit down and hold onto your hats!!

You know how double negatives work:

I'm going to the store.
I'm not going to the store.
I'm not not going to the store. --> Now we're sort of back to going to the store.

Or like in math:  4 = 4;    -4 = -4;    -(-4) = 4

So turn to D&C 49: 18 and look at what it really says.  I've been missing the double negative all these years:

"And whoso forbiddeth to abstain from meats, that man should not eat the same, is not ordained of God;"

Notice -- who is not ordained of God?  The person who forbids.  Forbids what?  Forbids abstaining!  Not forbids eating meat, but rather forbids abstaining.  Wow!  Get it?  I've been reading this scripture all these years as though it was saying that the person is not ordained of God who forbids eating meat.  That is not what it says.  One more time, it says:

The person is not ordained of God who forbids abstaining from eating meat, i.e. the person is not ordained of God who forbids vegetarianism!  Neat, no?

Now this whole set of passages makes sense, which it formerly didn't.

D&C 49: 18-21
18 And whoso forbiddeth to abstain from meats, that man should not eat the same, is not ordained of God; 19 For, behold, the beasts of the field and the fowls of the air, and that which cometh of the earth, is ordained for the use of man for food and for raiment, and that he might have in abundance. 20 But it is not given that one man should possess that which is above another, wherefore the world lieth in sin.
21 And wo be unto man that sheddeth blood or that wasteth flesh and hath no need.

In other words, it's wonderful in God's eyes to abstain from eating meat, except when we need it in times of winter, cold, famine, excess hunger, and to save our lives.  Life is precious.  But the animals give themselves to us willingly if we need them to save our lives.  (See the JS translation of Gen. 9: 10-11 on pg 797 of your quadruple combination, and also D&C 89: 12-15).

I believe Heavenly Father is always careful about how He says things, and I believe that He knew exactly that saying this in the way He said it would be easily misinterpreted, thus protecting us from further condemning ourselves.

I love it! Hope you did too and that it hasn't freaked you out too much. If it has, just ignore this post. Comments, anyone?

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Great ideas and posts, all for good physical and spiritual. health.
Interesting that when the W of W was first received, it guided us to minimize meat consumption as being overall unhealthy at the time, and to avoid the taking of animate life when alternatives are available to provide our protein and nutrient needs through vegetative sources.
It was the right idea, for the spirit and for the body in 1850. But it is so MUCH MORE SO today, with the mega agri business methods of producing and marketing meat and poultry.
To increase meat weight gain, livestock today are confined to minimize their use of energy. This means they put on more fat. And we know how very good animal fats with cholesteral are for our heart and arteries. NOT!
To maximize rapid weight gain, producers add bulk antibiotics into livestock feed at these Confined Animal Feeding Operations (CAFO). The antibiotics can increase weight gain by 20%. But using all these bulk antibiotics in animal feed has resulted in a lot of bacteria which are now resistant to antibiotics. These new bacteria are becoming a significant health threat, not only to livestock, but those antibiotic resistant traits have already been found to transfer to bacteria which can infect humans with the threatening consequence that their diseases can not be arrested with existent antibiotic therapies! Along with the directly unhealthy impacts from consuming meat, feedlot meat production is creating a significantly growing bacteriological threat.
And this is not even beginning to mention the enormously devastating and detrimental environmental impacts of such CAFOs on water quality and the environment.
If we would all follow the W of W and eat meat sparingly, in addition to the direct individual health benefits, we would not have this ominous agri business bacterialogical and environmental threat growing around us.
Some may rightfully bring up that livestock can be raised in a much more natural, healthful manner. Free range or pasture or grass fed cattle do contribute to the spread of disease resistant bacteria. And they have much less fat, so are healthier to eat. And on another perspective, an animal that lives its life on the free range is much closer to experiencing the natural life for which it was intended.
My own view, is that it's best if we minimize meat consumption. And for those who determine they want or need to eat some meat or poultry, or eggs or milk, if they can find such animal products from organic, free range farms, both they and the animals will enjoy much better health, biologically, spiritually, and emotionally.
One might also ponder what is done in production and marketing of milk today. Again, antibiotics are often used in dairy animals to promote herd health and to increase milk production. When cattle are milked, the milk is pastuerized. And if one does a search you will find great damage and degredation is done to the nutrient and health value of milk through this pastuerization.
In short, while the spiritual impact of taking the life of an animal to eat it remains the same today as it was in 1840, the personal and environmental health problems and threats resulting from eating meat have increased exponentially since the W of W was first revealed. And the spiritual blessings from following the W of W are a strong constant.

And on the earlier green tea considerations. First, one must adhere to the Spirit. If one ever feels they are in some way violating the spirit of the guidance from the Lord, then you must turn away and do what you perceive the Lord wants of you. In my long post earlier, you got the reasons why I believe and feel that green tea is beneficial to health, based on the science, and why I believe the W of W is to be used as a guidance for better physical and spiritual health. Cola drinks are not hot, but because I combine science knowledge with the W of W, I won't drink cola or whatever drink has caffeine. I drink green tea for what I believe are significant health benefits, and I make my green teas so it has less caffeine than hot chocolate. And I go to sleep after I drink it. I believe I'm strongly within the guidance of the W of W. But others may interpret differently, and I'm surely not telling anyone else to go against their principles, by no means.
Have you seen this article by President Packer from a talk he gave in 1966? He explains things quite well here too...so glad you brought this up.
I appreciate the many thoughts that have been shared on this topic and the tone in which thoughts are being shared and continue to be shared. As Rand suggested, ambiguity can often enable us to more fully use our facuties to receive truth. Certainly section 9 of the Doctrine and Covenants suggests that we consider all things and study issues fully if we desire to receive revelation on any subject. When we can carry on discussions following the pattern set forth in Section 50 of the D&C begining with verse 13, it always leads to good and to a fullness of truth. Again, thanks to each of you for carrying on a potentially controversial discussion in a manner that is uplifting and edifying to me personally.
Michelle, What article are you referring to by Pres. Packer? No link or reference is mentioned in your short post.
Sorry about that...I have added it now. (See the reply just above yours)
We just returned from 10 weeks in China and were stunned by the amount of meat that is being eaten today compared to just a few years ago! (We traveled to China in '83, '01, '04 and '06.) On this trip we found it very difficult to eat a meal without meat! We found very few vegetable plates and those that we did find were cooked in peanut oil! I hope that someone is following the cancer rates as wealth and meat consumption increase.
Yes! Thanks, that is wonderful! I have been misreading it also, or letting others misinterpret it too me for quite sometime. I could have used this to my advantage many times before instead of letting it be used against me!! HA! Seems funny that I wasn't able to see that more clearly, now that you have pointed that out! Thanks again! By the way, Kisi, I am Zeb Weeks' little sister. You introduced Daisy to all this and she introduced it to me, so THANKS! It has blessed my life and my families, just so nice to learn more healthy recipes, etc. to keep my family staying healthy!
Thanks, Michelle. Fun to have you on here! I just clicked on your link and read Pres. Packer's article.
The Western World encroaches yet further. Very sad. Thanks for your comment.
Well, how fun is that!? We miss having Zeb and Daisy live on our street and be in our ward. They are darling. What you said thrills me and made my whole day. Thanks so much. We'll be talking!
I am not sure if you are correct. You totally overlooked this part of the scripture:
behold, the beasts of the field and the fowls of the air, and that which cometh of the earth, is ordained for the use of man
for food and for raiment
For food- get it?
Also in the law of Moses the Israelites were eating meat all the time for ordinances and as part of their diet.
The only reason Daniel didn't eat the meat at the kings court was because it was not prepared according to the law of Moses. Now I will not argue with you that the meet today with all the hormones is according to the law of Mormons. hahaha
Maybe if we raised our own cows we could eat them the right way.
How about chicken? Many of my Lindon neighbors raise their own chickens - I love buying eggs from them.
It does say to eat meat sparingly.
I have noticed that if I eat more whole grains I crave less meat.

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